So I don't know if others know about the controversy pornhub and other adult sites have got themselves into, but it's giving me a lot of mixed signals. More bad than good, and reading about what's been going on makes my skin crawl and it makes me shake. A YouTube channel had uploaded their own commentary on the matter and I couldn't watch it. I went straight for the comments for what people has to say. A lot of them, like people do in society used to watch porn, not being aware of what was behind the scenes including myself. All the video checking these sites have done, with half of them being connected to r#pe, child exploitation, fetishizing groups, raw footage and illegal counterparts getting passed tags were all seriously concerning. Even verified videos didn't provide the fullest of consent with hired actors and actresses. Things like this are why I hate that I was exposed to porn, even hooked on the matter like a drug. There were videos that I've seen that were over the top, exaggerated, taken to extreme measures whether real or animated. At the time of browsing videos like these, my limited knowledge wasn't focused on whether or not the videos had consent or not because I along with many I assume has the impression that they all consented to the actions. Otherwise, why would they be uploaded to legal sites that "care" about the issue..? Hearing that a minor being assaulted with the video being put on these sites without her consent, kidnappings, molestation, or videos that don't even correspond to pornography ending up on these sites is triggering enough. While I don't necessarily blame pornhub entirely for horrible videos like these being posted all around, I do blame them for enabling the factor of hosting it in the first place. I feel sick. I feel dirty. I feel wrong. I feel like I've took part in something that harmed people. I feel like people who unintentionally just wanted to watch what they were attracted to, were unfortunately connected to something deeper than that. Worse than that in a sense. How could I along with many other people enjoy content like this when we are NEVER sure of the people in the videos doing it for fun or being hurt? How will we ever be sure of their ages in the video? How will we ever be sure if it's raw footage or not? I don't think viewers will ever know. But to see that adult sites are being hit with things like this is a form of a win, in the sense that victims need to be protected. This hurts both victims and sex workers of the adult material. And the viewers. I've wanted to cut pornography out of my life completely because I wanted to be lifted from an addiction and better myself. I wanted to go back to reality and not use the internet for erotic thrill. It was one thing to have used this as unsure experience in my adolescence, but it's not something I want to continue with anymore. I feel so disgusted with myself. I feel like I've done something horrible with watching videos like these just because I thought it was something I had to do to fit in and grow up with.

Well then what's the takeaway from all of this? Do I just exaggerate everything when it comes to these things? In the past I only enjoyed it because I didn't overthink all of the things like this or to take into account when I browse those videos. Now I don't watch it, trying to refrain from it all to see if there would be changes in how I can live without it. I haven't spent any money on pornography, but I knew I was addicted because while trying to quit watching, I couldn't. I think the part where you look at the addiction being damaged just so it can be reinforced as a form of reassurance is a little bit exaggerated. It can be dangerous for people and if they don't break the addiction it can get worse overtime without them knowing it. Especially if they aren't even enjoying the activity of watching porn in general. I wasn't trying to say that all sex workers are affected by that cause I know that they like what they do and get paid for what they do. I guess I was trying to bring up the topic of how much consent do they really have in the industry but I guess I'll never know that like a lot of people won't know. Me avoiding porn isn't just to avoid some kind of guilt, rather than to try and tone down how much of it I watch. I've been wanting to stop doing that since October and for the most part it's been working. I don't think I've visited a porn site ever since I got app blockers. ERP keeps getting brought up but idk how to do it when it comes to me.

@BigGip09 ERP would be watching it (acting normallly) despite the irrational guilt.

@Scoggy Would I have to? I've been trying to quit due to the addiction I had and trying to use my thoughts and occasionally softcore, which probably still counts but I don't want to go to porn sites.

@BigGip09 It seems pretty clear that you're labeling it as an addiction when it didn't cause harm. That's a habit, and your desire to quit that habit is, as you've explained yourself, coming from your moral OCD. Quitting would be a compulsion, and compulsions are a bad idea.

@Scoggy But what if it COULD cause harm as it either escalates or someone or myself gets hurt by being so attached to it? By preventing even watching porn I feel like I'm bettering myself and my wants rather than giving into urges that my body feels like it needs when it really doesn't. Besides, it makes me feel negative post session

@BigGip09 We take normal risks every single day which have the potential to cause harm, and doing so is not immoral. You're only focused on this one more than hundreds of others because you have OCD about it. I think it's better to resist the urge to give into moral compulsions for now and then in the future when your OCD is largely under control or is focused on other things, you could still revisit the idea of quitting porn as a lifestyle change if that idea still appeals to you without the guilt and moral/harm OCD interfering with your perspective and decision-making.

@BigGip09 Anytime you drink a beer you COULD become an alcoholic and start stealing from your family and friends, go to jail and ruin your life. If you had OCD about that, you'd probably feel pretty guilty and anxious after drinking a beer and have a desire to go teetotal despite the fact that none of the stuff you're imagining is happening or even likely. You might even rationalise it as being a way of bettering yourself and having self-mastery. Wouldn't change the fact that it's OCD.

@Scoggy So what you're saying is as of now it's better for me to not give into these compulsions but for later on it'll probably be better to visit porn if it means the OCD isn't still lurking? And what if it does come back in the future? Do I just do what I do for now?

@Scoggy I get that people could drink beer, watch porn, smoke a specific drug, or do any specific activity that they enjoy for a balanced amount, but can't too much of it become a problem for that person? Can't too much alcohol lead to severe body changes and functions, depression, and a turnaround on your life? Can't watching too much porn lead someone to escalate what they watch, how much money they pay for it, and how many activities they put aside to do it, or worse, act out what they see into real life? I can't help but rationalise it that way. Is that bad? Am I not suppose to do that? Is it my fault if I end up on the wrong video after browsing for content that's too disturbing even if it's on the legal site? All of this doesn't change that it's OCD, but I'm just confused on what to do besides the self compassion. What if I could go to jail in the blink of an eye?

@BigGip09 I mean that for now you should behave the way you did before OCD started making your decisions for you- i.e. watching porn just like anyone else. No avoidance compulsions. And later when your OCD gets better, you can think about whether you still want to quit porn as a lifestyle change when all the irrational OCD guilt is gone. Yes, addictions are bad. You can get addicted to almost anything. The whole point is that the whole world doesn't refuse to ever drink just because it's possible to become addicted, or refuse to eat junk food in case they get addicted and become 600lbs, or quit porn in case they get addicted and spend all their money on it. And your fears about acting out what they see in porn in real life is a little strange. Even if you liked rape porn you'd just be able to find a girl who is into it too, it doesn't turn people into rapists any more than watching a crime documentary makes someone rob a bank. You should do the self compassion, always looking for grey areas that make it a bit easier to be less severe on yourself, avoid compulsions and try to live your life. Everyone has the potential to commit a crime, either in purpose or accidentally, and then go to jail. If we all revolved our lives and decision making around that remote possibility, nobody would ever leave their houses.

@Scoggy So I should still watch porn and still be the person I was before this OCD struck? It's worth a shot. I do watch end up watching softcore porn anyway because some odd part of me feels like it's better than going to a legal porn site and getting everything hardcore hoping not to watch something too over the top. I don't know what to think about it or what to do. So do I just continue watching porn as much as I did before? You and an advocate here said that not watching it counts as avoidance which I shouldn't do. What is watching porn going to do for me and my OCD? Gross. I don't like rape porn because that doesn't sound legal. Even if it were a fantasy, I don't think I would watch it nor want to even think about acting it out in real life. I can't help but follow that possibility and make decisions based off of it. OCD tells me that it's already too late and it's already happened when I don't really think it has when it comes to the grey areas there. And I don't know about finding a girl that would be into it as well. I don't know if I want a relationship or not, as much as I fantasize about being in one. It's never felt like it would come true.

@BigGip09 Yep, live your life the way you lived it before OCD despite the guilt etc. Watching porn, because you've got a bit of an avoidance habit and it's triggering for you, is essentially going to be an exposure. Doing exposures goes one of two ways in terms of impacting your OCD. If you respond to the anxiety caused by the exposure with compulsions, your OCD gets worse. If you refuse to do compulsions and watch the porn/get off normally, despite the guilt, and refuse to do compulsions afterwards too, then the anxiety and guilt fade away on their own and your OCD starts to get better. It would be a very good idea to go online and look for lists and descriptions of mental compulsions so that you can identify as many as possible that you tend to do. That way you know exactly what to avoid doing when doing response-prevention when you do the exposure (watching porn). You *can* help but follow that possibility and make decisions based off it. You're in charge of your decisions and actions. No matter how much your brain is trying to insist that you obey what it tells you is safe and prevent/avoid anything it associates with danger, you're in charge of what you do and you have the ability to make decisions based on what is best for you rather than on what your OCD says is true (yet everyone else says is not reasonable). Sometimes it takes a leap of faith: being willing to treat it as if it's OCD despite not knowing for sure. Once you're over that hurdle and you're guided by something other than your OCD, it starts to really pay off. Your world expands a whole lot. For now, I wouldn't spend too much time dwelling on relationship stuff. I don't know whether I want one either, as I have a lot of mental illness, guilt/shame and intimacy issues etc. My OCD often tells me I'd end up hurting them or they'd someday feel I pretended to be a good person but actually am not. I know it's 90% OCD and I'm working on it, but I can only work on a few things at a time, and if the opportunity appears and it's only my neuroses preventing me from having the relationship, I'll focus on it more intensely. That might be a good approach for you too.

@Scoggy I suppose I'll watch it then. Especially for the exposure factor, which could help in terms of OCD. At the moment I have adult content blockers on my phone and I haven't been on legal porn sites since then. I've been using softcore YouTube videos more than I have porn sites. I don't know if that makes a difference or not, but the same type of guilt can approach sometimes. After I finish watching erotica, usually my thoughts are what begin to spiral more than physical anxiety could. It's more of mental compulsions than it is physical compulsions, but there are physical compulsions I do have, this app being one at times. I would go to this app and read posts I've bookmarked to "remind myself" that I'm okay and shouldn't worry about whatever my OCD says I should worry about. I am in charge of what I want to do and what decisions I want to make, but sometimes I second guess things making sure if it's the right thing for me to do. Rarely I wouldn't know what is the right decision, but when I know I have a choice, I think hard on what I would usually do, porn being one of them. I'm aware that I'm younger than you are and we may have different reasons as to why we are unsure about relationships, aside from mental health, but I can't help but be insecure about never having the experience before. I feel that if I did have the experience I wouldn't have watched porn in the first place, but I realize that's kinda dumb since couples can watch porn anyway I guess. I'm still not trying to worry about all the factors of a relationship, like hurting someone, getting heartbroken, cheated on or cheating myself, or not knowing what to do in a relationship.

@BigGip09 Resilience. Trying to avoid all possibility of pain in life is going to result in a life not lived. Know that you can survive and bounce back when things go wrong. You'll handle it, you'll find you're actually very capable in a pinch if you need to be. If you were the hero in the story of your life, what would that guy do? It takes bravery to live, knowing that things go wrong and that even when most things go right, it's eventually all taken away from you when you die. You came here with nothing and you will leave with nothing. You have nothing to lose.

@Scoggy I just had one little question. When you mentioned that I should watch the porn in terms of exposing myself to it regardless of the fears I've had or experienced at the time, isn't watching porn or masturbating to it a compulsion in of itself? Should I be doing it or not? Shouldn't I sit with the feelings of the discomfort and not do that?

@BigGip09 You have more of a problem with moral OCD causing you to avoid porn than a problem of having an obsession with porn that needs to be quit. So no I wouldn't characterise watching porn as a damaging compulsion, just a normal habit, whereas avoiding it is definitely something your OCD is pressuring you to do in several ways.

@Scoggy When you say moral OCD, does that refer to my morals alone connected to the people in the video? As if I shouldn't watch those videos because it may be bad that I'm watching two people have sex? Or that my morals have been skewed generally because of OCD? I'm trying to watch more of it and expose myself to it rather than not do it at all and think about it. When I get it over with, I find that I'm not thinking about it as much. I also feel like I'm defeating some themes as they come, but false memory OCD is beginning to intrude. How have you been doing? :)

@BigGip09 Moral OCD is having OCD about whether you're a good person and obsessions and compulsions tied to that.

@BigGip09 False memories are a bitch, especially as they're not always even of specific scenes but whole concepts, like an idea that you might have hurt someone when drunk or stole something when you went shopping or said something bad or embarrassing even though you don't have a memory of it or a specific idea of what it could be. Plus it comes with questioning your motivations. It really defies all reason sometimes :( I get them that I've plagiarised and the idea that I've done so on purpose thinking I'll get away with it. I guess a lot of moral OCD comes down to how we see ourselves, we get the feelings that we're bad and try to make the facts or possibilities line up to validate that idea. Doing that somehow feels better than ambiguity :( I'm mostly ok, just stuck indoors in the new lockdown in the south east of England so permanently bored and behind on schoolwork. You?

@Scoggy Yeah, fuck false memories honestly. And they always come after your morals since you would never do what it tells you that you may have done. Yet I feel like, I wouldn't have forgotten if something so drastic would have happened to me. Lately my false memories have been trying to tie in the sexting I did in my teen years towards right now, like if I did it with someone who wasn't of age. But I never engaged in sexting at 18 and I don't plan on doing it while I'm 19. It's not something I have an interest with anymore. I feel you on that one. Making up the facts to fall in line with that idea we can't get out of her head. My fear is doing something accidentally illegal I guess. But I don't think I have. Or at least anything really really bad. It's good to hear that you're doing fine. It's the same for me though, just down in NY. Not the best. I caught up with schoolwork just in time to try and catch up with everything. Not at all interested in next semester but I don't know what to do about all of it. You know, we could exchange a form of handles if you want to talk. You really helped me out with a lot of these issues by putting it into perspective. Sometimes we just need that once in a while. Only if you want though

@Scoggy I guess I have Moral OCD as well. I occasionally feel like a really horrible person, even though I don't focus on being one. It's hard.

@BigGip09 Hiya, I'm sorry I don't have social so I can't swap handles, I should probably get something so I don't have to hand out my email all the time lol

@Scoggy Yeah, haha. Might be of good use to reach out to friends here and there, you know? That's mainly why I created a Facebook. Not to use it at all, but for friends.

I'm actually not too against erotica in the form of literature or imagination alone. But when it comes to pornography, I don't watch any of it anymore, and I'm more imaginative than I am using visual arousal. I guess some people are more hornier than others and I'm one of them, so sometimes my thoughts can really set me off in a good way that shows I don't need porn. I'm actually more disgusted and less satisfied with watching porn than I am imagining it or making it softcore as possible. It's hard not to feel the guilt for those people though. I'm always uncertain on the status of those videos, especially with what's going on with adult sites right now. I'm really trying not to ruminate about it all

Yeah. I guess that's as honest as you can be with these videos. I never blame viewers for these kind of problems though, more the people supplying the videos, not disclosing the consent which they can through disclaimers, or people that flat out have it raw/inappropriate full on. For what I thought was kinks through video browsing more I think may have been something that went a little too far but I'm trying not to beat myself up for it

@BigGip09 Yeah but like, everyone has kinks and we do so much out of pure curiosity that there’s no point associating it with “right” or wrong because it’s just “curious” you know?

@n496 Yeah I guess that's very true. It's not like people with those kinks are bad people or associate with the wrong. Most of the things we come across is due to pure curiosity I suppose

Thanks! I realized that masturbating isn't the problem because it's something that still makes me feel good, but tying it with porn was my issue, and watching that content and browsing for the "perfect" video is often underwhelming, feelings of guilt, and disappointing. I'd rather just use my sexual imagination which a much more focused experience. I know that I didn't have that in my mind at the time and it never ever occurred to me much like many others did, but after learning that information makes me guilty still. It's like when I searched for 18 year olds on YouTube not expecting people debating about their age or worse, finding people taking regular videos of children and putting innuendos in videos, comments which has been going on for a while time on YouTube. I even googled a story similar to that. I'd rather just not risk looking at videos of people that haven't consented to things like this for the sake of visual pleasure when I can just close my eyes and do it on my own you know? Uncertainty wouldn't be so bad to sit through if I didn't ruminate so damn much. There's times where I'm not thinking about the events at all and I'm literally fine throughout the whole day until I come across a trigger or if I'm alone for too long. I don't know how to stop this

@n496 I guess when it comes to fears I have fears of going to jail, being accused of a sex crime, ruminations coming true. I don't know if it's so much fears as it is just me thinking about it, but I just want to wait for it to go away so I can continue on with me day. I guess it's because mine has to do with real event but even then there's times where I'm able to get over it only depending on how I feel through the day. How would I train myself not to ruminate about events that have already happened and forget them?

@BigGip09 You might go to jail man but you probably won’t and that is all you have to work with, I know it’s really hard but you’ve sort of got to be like “well yep I might be accused of [xyz], might go to jail” and be ok with it, trusting the fact that what you did is not good or bad and seeking comfort in the fact that everyone has probably done it at some point

@n496 Well, to answer that last part, I know that that's happened to a lot of people at some point but I don't think they went to jail or at the very least people didn't think they should be there, but that's just me trying to get the certainty again isn't it? The maybe maybe not this was enough to make my heart drop, but it always pops up as if it's the only way. How could I possibly be okay with going to jail? Or is this all a trick to my mind to prove something??

@BigGip09 I think the problem is you think you’re different to the rest and someone’s gonna single you out or something You’ve literally just got to sit with the fact that you’ll never get an answer - so you have to be ok with whatever you’re thinking about otherwise you’re just going to torture yourself

@BigGip09 It’s torturous in the short term and our hearts hate us for it but it’s the only way of lessening it’s grip on you, the only way to make it reoccur less often and less intense

@n496 Thinking I'm different from the rest. Well.. that's definitely the perfectionism showing up because I always feel the anxiety of not being accepted whether it be mistakes, failures, or who I am in general. It doesn't make any sense because when I made the mistakes I made years ago I never used to think about them afterwards. Never ever. It only came back when I saw years old text messages from online friends that I had talked to back in my high school days when I said a lot of stupid regrettable things that I wouldn't say to people now. Ever since I saw it this July or so, I never forgot about it. Then it caused me to feel guilty about more things I could find or exaggerate one thing from the other. When I tell people about these mistakes they tell me that it isn't a big deal and it's in fact normal what I did and part of growing up for teens these days. I want to agree with them strongly, and most times I do. But I just can't seem to stop going back and forth with these thoughts because they go with one conclusion to the next and over and over and over. With the more recent mistakes they have also happened with other people unintentionally and it was nothing more than just an unwarranted coincidence that invaded a behavior they usually enjoy. That's natural, right? When I put it like that, I feel pretty much fine for most days but then it keeps picking up the exaggerated parts of the event even though it's pretty much false but jumps to conclusions anyway. So just sit with these thoughts and do nothing at all? No matter how real they feel? No matter how convincing they feel they are? No matter how outrageous? No matter how repetitive?

@BigGip09 Yep, I know it’s not easy to hear but that’s exactly what you need to do. And trust me the thoughts will fade gradually in time if you do

@n496 Okay. I'm trusting you. So I just keep saying that the thoughts may be true or not true? Or that something may happen to me or something may not? How long will I have to do this?

@BigGip09 Just think about the fact that there is no definite answer, that you’ll never be able to be sure of either outcome and allow yourself to think about that for a bit and then try and do something like go for a walk. Every time you get scared because the thoughts come back, let them, they’re not evil and they’re not trying to hurt you, acknowledge them and then repeat the process That’s what works for me (I am not a therapist though)

@n496 You’ll have to do it for as long as you need to but every time will get slightly easier I hope this has helped a bit, good luck, you’ll be ok

@n496 Thanks for being here with me. Everything really helped

@BigGip09 I’m glad!! You got this

I don't follow the story on him. I know of the name, but I don't know what happened.

@BigGip09 No I mean he reported it. I meant I saw it on his show

@ArtNinjaGirl My bad lol

@ArtNinjaGirl Ooh. What did he report?

Honestly even if you did, you didn't have the intention to only look at that content. It's more to blame on others and the site itself when it comes to things like that because you can never be fully sure if what you watched had consent or was ethical. You just don't know behind the scenes of it. All viewers want in porn is the sex or the kink and that's fine. It just sucks that that happened to the site overall. I think you're fine though.